RETURN TO THE LAND OF ABRAHAM…
Posted By: acson005
Date: Saturday, 31 January 2009, 2:59 a.m.
Date: Saturday, 31 January 2009, 2:59 a.m.
In Response To: ISRAEL HOPES TO
COLONIZE PARTS OF IRAQ AS 'GREATER ISRAEL' (Theresa)
It makes a lot of sense if Jews really wanted to return to the land of their forefather, ABRAHAM.
As I have said…the so-called PROMISED LAND was never biblically promised to the JEWS. If you reread the Bible with little understanding, the promise was to Abraham and his son Ishmael (Arabs). Isaac, from whose loins the so-called Jews of today are descended, was not even born when the promise was made. Abraham was 99 years old and his son Ishmael was 13 years of age when they were both circumcised as a seal of the covenant (Bible). Isaac was nowhere near…nada; not yet human!
acson005
SKYPE>
: Israel hopes to colonize parts of Iraq as ‘Greater Israel’
: By Wayne Madsen
: Online Journal Contributing Writer
: Jan 30, 2009, 00:20
: (WMR) -- Israeli expansionists, with their intentions to take full
: control of the West Bank and the Gaza Strip and permanently
: keep the Golan Heights of Syria and expand into southern
: Lebanon, already well known, also has its eyes on parts
: of Iraq considered part of a biblical “Greater Israel.”
: Israel reportedly has plans to relocate thousands of Kurdish
: Jews from Israel, including expatriates from Kurdish Iran,
: to the Iraqi cities of Mosul and Nineveh under the guise of
: religious pilgrimages to ancient Jewish religious shrines.
: According to Kurdish sources, the Israelis are secretly
: working with the Kurdistan Regional Government (KRG) to
: carry out the integration of Kurdish and other Jews into
: areas of Iraq under the control of the KRG.
: Kurdish, Iraqi Sunni Muslims, and Turkmen have noted that
: Kurdish Israelis began to buy land in Iraqi Kurdistan,
: after the U.S. invasion in 2003, which is considered
: historical Jewish “property.”
: The Israelis are particularly interested in the shrine of the
: Jewish prophet Nahum in al Qush, the prophet Jonah in
: Mosul, and the tomb of the prophet Daniel in Kirkuk.
: Israelis are also trying to claim Jewish “properties”
: outside of the Kurdish region, including the shrine of
: Ezekiel in the village of al-Kifl in Babel Province near
: Najaf and the tomb of Ezra in al-Uzayr in Misan Province,
: near Basra, both in southern Iraq’s Shi’a-dominated
: territory. Israeli expansionists consider these shrines and
: tombs as much a part of “Greater Israel” as Jerusalem and
: the West Bank, which they call “Judea and Samaria.”
: Kurdish and Iraqi sources report that Israel’s Mossad is
: working hand-in-hand with Israeli companies and “tourists”
: to stake a claim to the Jewish “properties” of Israel in
: Iraq. The Mossad has already been heavily involved in
: training the Kurdish Pesha Merga military forces.
: MORE:
: http://onlinejournal.com/artman/publish/article_4301.shtml
THE PROMISED LAND… *PIC*
Posted By: acson005
Date: Saturday, 31 January 2009, 1:40 p.m.
Date: Saturday, 31 January 2009, 1:40 p.m.
In Response To: Re: RETURN TO THE
LAND OF ABRAHAM… (Socrate)
Hi Socrate…although Prophet Abraham (a.s.) is one of the prophets repeatedly mentioned in the Qur’an, there is no such thing as Promised-Land in the Holy Book of Islam.
As I have always maintained, the genius of the Jewish people is the early recognition of the extreme value of media control from the writing of the Bible to today’s word war in the media.
I copied and pasted the following verses from the King James Version of the Bible. I omitted some verses to make it shorter and made 2 insertions in parentheses at 17:6 and 17:20.
11:31: And Terah took Abram his son, and Lot the son of Haran his son's son, and Sarai his daughter in law, his son Abram's wife; and they went forth with them from Ur (part of today’s IRAQ) of the Chaldees, to go into the land of Canaan; and they came unto Haran, and dwelt there.
Genesis 17
1: And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.
2: And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.
5: Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.
6: And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee. (16:10: And the angel of the LORD said unto her (Hagar), I will multiply thy seed exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude.)
8: And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.
10: This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man-child among you shall be circumcised.
15: And God said unto Abraham, As for Sarai thy wife, thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be.
16: And I will bless her, and give thee a son also of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of people shall be of her.
17: Then Abraham fell upon his face, and laughed, and said in his heart, Shall a child be born unto him that is an hundred years old? and shall Sarah, that is ninety years old, bear?
18: And Abraham said unto God, O that Ishmael might live before thee!
19: And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.
20: And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes (founders of the 12 tribes of the Ishmaelite) shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation.
21: But my covenant will I establish with Isaac, which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the following year.
22: And he left off talking with him, and God went up from Abraham.
23: And Abraham took Ishmael his son, and all that were born in his house, and all that were bought with his money, every male among the men of Abraham's house; and circumcised the flesh of their foreskin in the selfsame day, as God had said unto him.
24: And Abraham was ninety years old and nine, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin.
25: And Ishmael, his son, was thirteen years old when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin.
26: In the selfsame day was Abraham circumcised, and Ishmael his son.
The Surfing The Apocalypse
Network
OK... Last Word
Posted By: jimhebert <Send E-Mail>
Date: Monday, 2 February 2009, 9:34 p.m.
Date: Monday, 2 February 2009, 9:34 p.m.
: OK…LAST WORD
: When you read the bible as an outsider, like say…you are not blinded by your faith, you will see how the generations of
: Jacob (the so-called 12 tribes) keeps injecting themselves into the Bible. I had the feeling (honestly) that the verses you quoted were interpolation for how will God make: a covenant with an unborn…not even conceived child. Someone: put it there to make it look like Isaac was the favored child. Further reading will give you the feeling that the generations of Jacob were rebellious not only against God, but against their forefather Abraham because of this: the so-called PROMISED LAND and the loved son…ISHMAEL.
: I recommend that you read further the biblical story of the twin sons of ISAAC…ESAU and JACOB. The intense rivalry was not between Ishmael and Isaac but between the twin brothers…ESAU and JACOB. I am telling you…a sour tree: cannot bear sweet fruits.
: I enjoyed this as well,: acson005
Since everything in the Bible (more ancient and original versions) correlates in time and sequence with no discrepancies or contradictions, it is very likely that the someone that you mention, “Someone put it there to make it look like Isaac was the favored child”, is Hashem. And yes, it is only to be expected that the 12 tribes would be “injecting themselves into the Bible” since they play a central theme as they are the chosen people, according to Genesis, as previously discussed. Yes, the 12 tribes did fall into idolatry and lost their inheritance, as we read in the book of Kings and others. However, through divine providence the result was the Messiah and gospel of redemption which made it possible, provided they keep Hashem’s commandments, for not only the 12 tribes to return to their lost inheritance, but also for all nations of the world including the descendants of Ishmael, Esau, and any other of the Gentile nations to be accepted as adopted sons and heirs into the very soon to be Kingdom of the Land Covenant. Galatians 3:28,29; Gal 4:7
Blessings to you, and have a nice day.
The Surfing The Apocalypse
Network
Re: RETURN TO THE LAND *TO* ABRAHAM????
Posted By: jimhebert <Send E-Mail>
Date: Monday, 2 February 2009, 9:24 p.m.
Date: Monday, 2 February 2009, 9:24 p.m.
In Response To: RETURN TO THE LAND
*TO* ABRAHAM???? (gimp)
I don't know too much about the scriptures, although I read the good book cover to cover once, prompted by curiosity. What you guys are discussing is about the first testament, I believe.
Didn't old JC come around to create the new section of the Bible, strangely enough called the New Testament, where all the old rules and regulations were discarded?
That’s correct to a certain extent. The part that Yeshua did away with is referred to in Galatians 3:12. Very few, if any, pastors from any religion, faith, or creed will ever explain that verse because they simply don’t understand it for the simple reason that they don’t know the Old Testament. Go to Deuteronomy 27:15 and read the curses that were to befall the Israelites if they did not keep Hashem’s commandments when they occupied the Promised Land after the Exodus. Because of Solomon marrying and having 1000 idolatrous Hittites, Canaanites, etc, Hashem took 10 tribes away from Solomon. Read 1 Kings 11. Later, the 10 tribes fell into the same practices. As a result, they received the curse of Deut 28:25. That verse occurred in 721BC when the Assyrian Empire dispersed the 10 tribes and to this day have never returned to their inheritance. It’s been over 2700 years. The other two tribes, Judah and Benjamin, were dispersed in 70 AD and 136 AD. The Jews began returning around the time of 1948, when Israel was established as a nation again. Soon, according to Ezekiel 37:15, etc, and many other verses, the union of the 10 tribes (house of Israel) and the other 2 tribes (House of Judah) will be reunited in that same Promised Land. Ezekiel 37:21,22. This is only a small part of how the Old was done away with. No more curses. But the 10 commandments are still mandatory. I’ll stop because I don’t want to write a book about this on this forum.
I lack any sort of dogmatic view on this subject, seeing as I don't belong to any church or sectarian group. So therefore I ask why is this subject so important. Are you suggesting it would be 'right' for the "TRUE" owners [according to your scripture [outmoded perhaps] of the land "given by God" to overtake/seize the land where others dwell today?
I am not to say what is right or wrong. All I know is what the Bible says.
Are you content with the bloodshed in the Gaza Strip?
I don’t think anyone likes it. Only Hashem knows the heart of every person and his judgement, you can bet, will be just. It’s coming to a head. Read Isaiah 11.
Is this what your good book and your God wishes?
That’s what it says, and if that’s what Hashem wants, you can bet it will happen.
If so, dear Sir or Madam, please keep your good God and your dear book to yourself!
I plan on doing that as best I can and sharing it with anyone with an open mind and open heart.
I, for one, have had quite ENOUGH of religious war based on the hyperbole you propound. And I'm very sure the Mothers without the kids they had last month in Palestine couldn't care less about your Abraham and more about burying their dead without getting shot at by "God's Chosen." I did NOT enjoy it.
Not many, I’m sure. I think they had better begin to care about what the Bible says about Abraham, etc. The Pharaoh of Egypt had pretty much the same attitude of stubbornness, and well, we all know the rest of that story. When Hashem says jump, you’d better ask how high. Or else. It boils down to “OBEY”. Man is the created. Hashem is the creator. He makes the rules. It’s the Bible.
I would like to say Peace. But there will be no peace until the Christian Moral Majority .. The Pentecostal Church, among others, ceases its contributions to the Zionist army, which aims to control the world. The destruction in Gaza is a prelude.
Hashem’s will will prevail. Moral majority, etc., or not.
That's NOT in the scripture. 2000 years on, we're writing a NEW Testament.
I don’t get your point.
Have a pleasant day.
OK…LAST WORD: WELCOME TO NEW JERUSALEM
*PIC*
Posted By: acson005
Date: Tuesday, 3 February 2009, 9:43 a.m.
Date: Tuesday, 3 February 2009, 9:43 a.m.
Hi Jimhebert,
You said…
However, through divine providence the result was the Messiah and gospel of redemption which made it possible, provided they keep Hashem’s commandments, for not only the 12 tribes to return to their lost inheritance, but also for all nations of the world including the descendants of Ishmael, Esau, and any other of the Gentile nations to be accepted as adopted sons and heirs into the very soon to be Kingdom of the Land Covenant. Galatians 3:28,29; Gal 4:7
DO YOU MEAN THE NEW JERUSALEM…?
The following building (in the picture) is the first house of worship built by Abraham and his son Ishmael for the worship of God (you don’t have to believe it). This is the reason for the sacrifice where God asked Abraham to sacrifice his…“ Take now thy son, thine only son…22:2 (and somebody put the name of Isaac as if Abraham didn’t know he had only one son at the time.)” meaning in the same light as the covenant of the PROMISED LAND…ISAAC WAS NOT YET BORN (again…you don’t have to believe it). Long before Islam, idol worshippers in the Arabian Peninsula and North Africa brought their Idols to the house of worship that their forefather Abraham built, and together with Jews and Christians in the region celebrated annually the DAY OF SACRIFICE, better known then (before Islam) and now (day of Islam) as the HAJJ PILGRIMAGE. I don’t really know at what point in time that others except Muslims were barred from the city of Mecca. I assume that most, if not all, regular loggers at STA know the story of the conquest of MECCA by the Prophet, who then cleansed it of 360 idols and re-declared as in the day of Abraham the ONENESS OF GOD.
“Jesus saith unto her, woman, believe me, the hour cometh when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the father.” John 4:21 means there will be a New Jerusalem for the worship of the Father. This Jesus’ prophecy was fulfilled 600 years later when God, through the angel Gabriel, told the prophet Mohammad (p.b.u.h.) to change the direction of his mosque in Medina from Jerusalem to Mecca six months after it was built.
PSALMS 84:4 ‘Blessed are those who dwell in your house, they are ever praising you. Blessed are those whose strength is in you who have set their hearts on pilgrimage. As they pass the valley of BACCA, they make it a place of spring, and the autumn springs also cover it with pools.
Qur’an 3:96 ‘The first house of worship appointed for men was that at BAKKA, full of blessings and of guidance for all the worlds.’
It is no longer (as far as I am concerned) a question of whether the HARAM MOSQUE in MECCA is the BIBLICAL NEW JERUSALEM. What I found truly amazing, maybe staggering, is how the DREAMER OF THE BOOK OF REVELATION saw it in minute details after 1994, when the 3 SOUTH GATES were built, which completed the 12 GATES as prescribed (3 in the EAST/3 in the WEST/3 in the NORTH/3 in the SOUTH) in the Bible.
HERE GOES…THE NEW JERUSALEM
Rev. 21:12 “It had a great high wall with 12 gates…”
21:13 “There were 3 gates on the East, 3 on the North, 3 on the South, and 3 on the West…”
21:16 “The city was laid out like a square as long as it was wide…”
21:17 “He measured its walls and it was 144 cubits [200 feet]…”
21:24 “The nations will walk by its light and the kings of the Earth will bring their splendor into it…”
21:25 “On no day will its gates ever be shut for there will be nights there…”
21:26 “The glory and honor of nations will be brought to it…”
21:27 “Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor anyone who does what is shameful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life.
21:16 “He measured the city with a rod and found it to be 12,000 stadia [2,000 km]…” (Note: it took me 3 months to solve the 2,000 km riddle. It is the distance between the OLD and the NEW JERUSALEM…the distance that ABRAHAM used to travel while he walked among men that separated his two sons…ISHMAEL and ISAAC.)
(Watch the National Geographic Special: INSIDE THE HAJJ at youtube.com and tell me if it is not the Prophesied Biblical New Jerusalem. Some people call me nuts because they say…it would mean that the Second Coming, which is conditional on the coming of the New Jerusalem, is imminent, and the END TIME is near. I said...BE THE JUDGE)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89fVjocohzU
OK…HERE GOES IN SEVERAL WORDS *PIC*
Posted By: acson005
Date: Tuesday, 3 February 2009, 5:07 p.m.
Date: Tuesday, 3 February 2009, 5:07 p.m.
In Response To: NEED SOME HELP... (Younge)
ISLAM IS THE NATURAL EVOLUTION OF THE WORSHIP OF THE ONE ALMIGHTY GOD FROM ADAM TO MOHAMMAD WITH ALL THE OTHER PROPHETS (MAY THE PEACE AND BLESSINGS OF ALLAH BE UPON THEM ALL) IN BETWEEN. THE PROPHET CLAIMED THAT HE IS THE SEAL OF ALL THE PROHETS. WITH HIM…THE MESSAGE FROM GOD HAS ENDED.
acson005
Re: OK…LAST WORD: WELCOME TO NEW
JERUSALEM
Posted By: jimhebert <Send E-Mail>
Date: Wednesday, 4 February 2009, 1:05 a.m.
Date: Wednesday, 4 February 2009, 1:05 a.m.
In Response To: OK…LAST WORD: WELCOME
TO NEW JERUSALEM *PIC* (acson005)
“This is the reason for the sacrifice where God asked Abraham to sacrifice his…“ Take now thy son, thine only son…22:2 (and somebody put the name of Isaac as if Abraham didn’t know he had only one son at the time.)” meaning in the same light as the covenant of the PROMISED LAND…ISAAC WAS NOT YET BORN (again…you don’t have to believe it).”
Correction again in your analyses, and also the sources you get your info from. They are definitely not Biblical. In Gen 21:9, we see that Ishmael was causing family problems by mocking. He definitely was not an heir (vs 10). One can see how the conflicts we’ve seen for so long in that region of the world began and seem to be closely associated with Ishmael's picking and mocking. Abraham was then forced to send Hagar and Ismael out the house (vs. 14). It’s not until the next chapter 22, that we see Abraham takes his only son Isaac, since Ishmael, at that time, wasn’t even living in the same household but was in the wilderness of Paran (Gen 21:21) which is in the desert of Arabia. Mecca is in the center of Paran. That’s about a couple of hundred miles from Beersheba, where Abraham, Sarah, and Isaac were living. We also know that it is south of Sinai.
Deuteronomy 33:2 'The LORD came from Sinai and dawned over them from Seir; he shone forth from Mount Paran. He came with myriads of holy ones from the south, from his mountain slopes.'
Paran is nowhere near Moriah (Gen 22:2), which is in Palestine, where the sacrifice was to take place.
I don’t have the time to discuss any of the other things you mentioned. I suggest you study the Bible and use it as your reference instead of television, YouTube, and other sources where opinions, theories, and other non-documented ideas are as numerous as Carter’s little pills.
Have a nice day.
